Marcel
Grape Puncher
Posts:875
 | | 11/21/2003 12:49 AM |
| I wanted to try something different from my usual Catena and Lapostolle Chardonnay, so why not Chablis? But I don't know much about it (except it's a French AOC in Burgundy and it's made with Chardonnay), so could anyone help me?
1. So what is it? Is it wooded or unwooded? What's the difference (if any) between a Chablis and a Maconnais or Montrachet?
2. What do you usually eat with it? The basic Chardonnay stuff? (seafood, light chicken, etc.)
3. What should I buy? Only "Chablis Grand Cru" and "Chablis Premier Cru"? Or are "Chablis" and "Petit Chablis" any good? Do you suggest any particular producer?
TIA! | | | |
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ChangeMe
Master of Wine
Posts:12891
| | 11/21/2003 1:03 AM |
| i would if i could, but can't so i won't 
i am sure someone will help you out | | | |
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stemor
Collierville, TN
Wine Thief
Posts:2807
| | 11/21/2003 1:33 AM |
| Riesling.  | |
Cheers, y'all | |
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ChangeMe
Master of Wine
Posts:11169
| | 11/21/2003 3:18 AM |
| | Mars, Ilove Chablis. These copmments apply to Grand and Premier Cru Chablis. It's very lightly oaked. I don't know this for a fact, but I wouldn't be surprised if they use neutral barrels. It's crisp and balanced, simply wonderful. I find the best Chablis the equal of many wines labeled Montrachet, Batard-Montrachet, and Chevalier-Montrachet. My favorite producers for this style of wine are Moreau, Pic, and Ravenau. My favorites are the Grand Crus and my favorite of the seven is Les Clos. My favorite Les Clos is a small, hard-to-find production by Jean Moreau called Clos des Hospices. Get these only from a very good year in Burgundy. In the off years it can be disappointing. | | | |
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ChangeMe
Grape Stomper
Posts:152
| | 11/21/2003 12:17 PM |
| What to eat?
Well, Chablis is generally considered great with oysters specifically and seafood in general.
The acidity is higher than average for Chardonnay. | | | |
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Marcel
Grape Puncher
Posts:875
| | 11/21/2003 1:18 PM |
| Wow, oysters are a good sugestion... just thinking about them make me hungry! I might pick some up and pair it with the Chablis. Let's time I bought 6 dozens of oysters and we went through some trouble to eat everything, so I'll try not to exceed myself this time!
Board-O, thanks for the tips! I guess I'll begin with a 1er cru and if I like the style I'll move to a Grand Cru, although I think I won't find the Clos des Hospices here... Recent good vintages are 95-97, right? How long can a Chablis from a good vintage last? As long as a white Burgundy (decades)? | | | |
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ChangeMe
Master of Wine
Posts:11169
| | 11/21/2003 1:31 PM |
| They can last a long time, but like all dry white wines, my preference is to have them at about 4 years after vintage date. I don't believe they improve after that, though they may hold for an additional decade. Some might say longer. I'd go for the '99s. Btw, I bought three bottles of the '97 Moreau Les Clos and found it extremely disappointing.
If you pair it with oysters, I'd be careful what sauce I used. Traditional cocktail sauce or vinaigrette would not be my choice. Maybe an aioli. | | | |
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TCK
Barrel Filler
Posts:1279
| | 11/21/2003 2:14 PM |
| Chablis is usually fermented and aged in steel tanks. The flavors that define it are slate, flint, and other minerals laced through crisp acidic tree fruit. You will not find the same buttery overtones here that you do in Montrachet or other Burbundy from the Cote d'Or.
Regular Chablis is very much like a basic Macon. It is at the higher levels that Chablis rules. A grand cru Chablis is head and sholders above Pouilly Fuise. They are so distinctive.
Chablis ages wonderfully do to the high acidity. However, I think it goes through an odd stage after about 3 or 4 years where it smells like wet wool. I have a freind who has a good deal of older Chablis so I do know that this blows off after a few years. This does not mean that they aren't great young.
As a rule I pair them with briney seafood like oysters. I also like them with earthy fresh water fish like trout and bass.
Chablis is a must try for anyone interested in wine for no other reason then to see the versatility of the Chardonnay grape.
TCK | | | |
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TCK
Barrel Filler
Posts:1279
| | 11/21/2003 2:19 PM |
| As a producer I would go for a Laroche. They are getting better every year. This is a reasonably priced producer on the rise in my opinion. There are others that are better but these are a good introduction.
Raveneau is my favorite producer, Brocard is another very good one. | | | |
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Eric White
San Ramon, CA
Advanced Sommelier
Posts:9053
| | 11/21/2003 3:46 PM |
| I too love Chablis. TCK summed up the flavor profile well for the vast majority of Chablis, though in truth it does come in a range of styles - just to a much lesser extent. I believe Board-O is correct that neutral oak is typical, though some producers use new oak, and though rare, fully oaked Chablis does exist.
One terrific producer to seek out is Le Chablisienne - this is a fairly large cooperative producer which produces a wide range of wines from Petite Chablis up to Grand Cru, all at fair prices (the Grenouille and Les Preuses really stood out when we were there).
Chablis is also an outstanding region to visit. Beautiful, historic, and terrifically hospitible. The growers and producers are genuinely glad to recieve visitors and are warm and welcoming. | | | |
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Eric White
San Ramon, CA
Advanced Sommelier
Posts:9053
| | 11/21/2003 4:12 PM |
| interesting, in verifying my spelling of "La Chablisienne" I looked up theirWeb Site, nice site! Available in English, and a great recipe section | | | |
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Stefania Wine
San Jose, CA
Grape Puncher
Posts:725
| | 11/21/2003 6:06 PM |
| | Mars, I'm a Chablis fan as well. Los Clos is also my favorite. Eric's recommendation of the Le Chablisienne co-op is a good one. I think you'll find the Grand cru's from them at prices from $20-$50. Los Clos is usually the most expensive at $50-$60 from top producers, although I paid just $33 for 2000 J.M. Broucard Los Clos. 2000 is a great vintage IMHO and still available. 2001 was a little spotty and I skipped it by in large on reports that 2002 would be good as well. | |
Paul Romero - Owner/Winemaker Stefania Wine
www.stefaniawine.com | |
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Pool Boy
Laurl, MD (DC suburb)
Master of Wine
Posts:13626
| | 11/21/2003 6:28 PM |
| | Considering the fact that I am *allowed* too buy whites on an as needed basis even though I am on wine probation, this thread is as timely as it is educational. Grazie! | |
www.roguefood.com -- www.cellartracker.com | |
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Marcel
Grape Puncher
Posts:875
| | 11/21/2003 7:24 PM |
| Indeed! The information here is great... I'll look for some of the producers recommended and see how it works. Thanks a lot for the help! | | | |
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Jeremy Matthew
Barrel Sampler
Posts:2067
| | 11/22/2003 12:55 AM |
| My Favourites Chardonnays are decent Chablis. The wine isn't just aged in Stainless it is also aged in oak, and can vary from producer to producer. In fact Parker discuss that the primary influences on good Chablis are in fact Oak, cropping and the degree with which the wine is proccessed. He makes very little mention of stainless although I do know it is commonly used in the Viilage and Petite Chablis blends. So I am sure it used in some years in superior wines to retain the typical Chablis mineral characters and wet wool notes that are so often associated with Chablis.
Due to the very cold area and impossibly lean soils (Parker has said in his books that Chablis is amongst the hardest place on earth to grow grapes due to soils, climate and continual frosts) malic acids tend to dominate. What oak influence is often evident in Chablis is more of a charry note rather than a vanilla note. Please note that is a generalisation.
Part of the reason for such acid dominated chardonnay is because the grapes have a hard time ripening. They're further north than either Champagne or Cote' d'or but are situated considerably closer to Champagne than Burgundy proper, meaning that the limey soils that dominate and produce the acid requirements for good bubbles also predominate here.
My favoured producers
J Dauvissat
R Dauvissat
Joseph Drouhin
Laroche | | | |
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Winetex
Austin, Texas
Master of Wine
Posts:10355
| | 11/22/2003 2:18 AM |
| | No one has mentioned Verget but they are a good Chablis producer. I still have a bottle of the '98 Verget Chablis Bougros Grand Cru that is in line to drink very soon. WS gave it a 96 and IWC a 90-94. I think oysters are in order! | | | |
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ChangeMe
Grape Stomper
Posts:152
| | 11/24/2003 9:20 AM |
| Wow!
Aioli - Board-O, thanks for that suggestion! I'm an utter novice to oysters, so I have no idea if that is a traditional combination, but it sounds mouth watering! | | | |
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ChangeMe
Master of Wine
Posts:11169
| | 11/24/2003 1:19 PM |
| | Markus, I love it with seafood. With a hand blender it takes only seconds to make. I use 50% EVOO and 50% peanut oil. | | | |
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ChangeMe
Grape Stomper
Posts:152
| | 11/25/2003 9:43 AM |
| | Thankyou Board-O - I will try that! | | | |
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ChangeMe
Grape Destemmer
Posts:98
| | 12/09/2003 4:31 AM |
| I am a friend of Freud's and he directed me to this post. Let's call me Redneck. I just returned from three weeks in Chablis and tasted about 100 producers.
Chablis is quite different from Macon or Montrachet for a variety of factors, mainly:
1) Chablis very far north, so it is much colder here than in the Cote d'Or or the Maconnais. This is important because it causes the wines to have very high acidity.
2) Its soil is different is also different from Burgundy proper. It is a mixture of chalk and clay with thousands of comma shaped oyster fossils called exogyra virugula. This soil, Kimmeridgian, gives the wines aromas that are commonly referred to as pierre a la fusil -- gunflint. But this simplifies it a bit. The clay in the soil also gives it an earthy tinge and often one finds just a hint of petrol (it should be pointed out that Jurassic area soil of which Kimmeridgian is a subset is also found in some areas of German Wine Country).
There are about three hundred producers and indeed the use of oak varies. I estimate that half use stainless steel alone, half use some oak. Some producers use as much as 100% new oak on some or all of their cuvees. Some use only older oak.
I agree completely with TCK that after 3 -4 years they often go into an unsure phase. For instance, many of the 2000's are quite dumb right now despite being very good wines and quite expressive a year ago. For young wines the 2002's are spectacular across the board, If you'd like to try something more mature, if you find some '97's they are drinking quite well right now.
Oysters are the classic match, but Chablis is versatile and is often an accompaniement to for instance ham in white wine and cream sauce. Chaource is not far nor is Soumaintrain and these cheeses work well.
I could recommend a ton of producers and wines. The overall consistency level is at an all time high there. To get a true sense of what the gunflint is all about, a good bet is Daniel Dampt Chablis 1er Cru, Les Lys if you can find it. Most consider the top producers to be R & V Dauvissat, Francois Raveneau, and perhaps Louis Michel. William Fevre's wines today are great although in the past they were too oaky for me. Billaud-Simon is a lesser-known producer that's really putting out spectacular stuff.
If you have any other questions let me know.
The Redneck | | | |
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