GATC
Barrel Sampler
Posts:2420
 | | 11/22/2002 2:53 AM |
| I've noticed that there tends to be strong differences in opinion about certain wines. I used to think that people were on different spots on the learning curve and this explained the differences in taste. But now I'm not so sure. Then I thought that people just had different personal preferences, just like everyone is different. But now, I'm starting to think that physiological factors may have a bigger influence.
I remember Jones making a comment to the effect that Parker could not sense brett. George Bush (Sr.) and many others hate brocolli. Others hate brussell sprouts. Scientist found out that there are chemicals in both that makes them repulsive to some people.
I've always wondered why some people loved German riesling and others hate it. I've also wondered why new world chardonnays that taste like listerine with oak chips to me, is the most popular varietal.
I guess we should celebrate the difference (I won't use the more common french phrase), but we should consider this when we critique or judge others. I've had the belief that Laube rates wines for the beginners. Maybe that is neither fair or correct. However, I've consciously ignored any of his ratings because there are enough differences from my tastes to make them useless for my purposes. | | | |
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JonesWineNo1
Sommelier
Posts:8568
| | 11/22/2002 3:21 AM |
| | I believe Parker can sense Brett but he doesn't find it as objectionable as some. (I, for one, cannot stand Brett except in trace amounts). A percentage of the population has more taste receptors in the mouth than others. I believe that plays a definite factor in wine appreciation. I also believe that the learning curve plays a huge role as does ones upbringing (if you are raised on Coca Cola you are more likely to appreciate wines with sweetness etc.) | | | |
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Joseph Bembry
Wine Lover
Posts:4875
| | 11/22/2002 3:47 AM |
| Very interesting post GATC. I have to agree that the learning curve has a lot to do with how wine is percieved. Some wines just seem more accessible, thus more pleasing to an untrained palate. For instance, when I first got into wine, I was under the impression that a good Chardonnay should be very oak driven and buttery. I didn't really know what oak was in a wine, but if it didn't have it, it was crap to me. I even went so far as to ask a person at a tasting room (Clos du Bois) who make a "nice, fat, buttery Chardonnay." I was given an earful about Burgundian blah, blah and pretty much embarassed.
Jones, I think you are on to something as well. I have a real sweet tooth and I know that I gravitate towards highly extracted wines, that tend to be fruit forward and almost syrupy. I also have a great appreciation for feminine styles of winemaking as well, ie my love affair w/ Burgundy. I think all those years of cupcakes and white zin may give me a higher threshold for sweetness. Poopy smells in wine real bother the crap out of me. (pun somewhat intended).
jb | | | |
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Dr_Tannin
Barrel Sampler
Posts:2498
| | 11/23/2002 1:59 AM |
| Add adaptation and sensitivity to individual genetic variation and my 93 is your 88.
DrT | | | |
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GATC
Barrel Sampler
Posts:2420
| | 11/23/2002 2:43 AM |
| Good points as expected. Nice to discuss subjects with my favorite forumites without intevening divergent off the wall comments intended to be funny.
I have to admit that I am affected by good and bad wines. If I have a good wine that is intense with gobs of fruit, I will start drinking more of those wines. If I have a bad chardonnay at a restaurant, I go home and give away all of my chards except for the Kistler and B-C's. Ever since I went to the Great Australian tasting and the distributor directed me to Canned Goods where they had pallets of German rieslings that were marked down from the $15-17 range to $5-6 and I bought 4 cases of the best, I've been on a riesling kick. The presence of the best year since 1971 isn't helping. Believe it or not, the last German rieslings before I had a 1998, was the great 1971's. I'm sure I'll get off that kick and maybe go to old Bordeaux's again.
I was going to say that I don't like sweet things, but that is not entirely true. I hate candy, but I really enjoy something that has a hint of sweetness. i guess that is why a spatlese with a lot of acid to balance the slight sweetness is heaven to me, but I hate the sweeter wines.
I used to think that the reason that I disagreed with people on wine was primarily based on their ignorance of wine. Now that we have these great forums to discuss wines among people who know a lot about them (as opposed to the masses), I realize that there are other factors. | | | |
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JonesWineNo1
Sommelier
Posts:8568
| | 11/23/2002 3:08 AM |
| | That is true GATC but experience is still the biggest determining factor imo. If the best Cab a taster has ever had is a 97 Opus then how can that taster calibrate their palate to the best of wines? | | | |
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GATC
Barrel Sampler
Posts:2420
| | 11/23/2002 3:33 AM |
| | I would agree with you. I think the transformation in my thinking is that it is the not the only thing. | | | |
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JonesWineNo1
Sommelier
Posts:8568
| | 11/23/2002 3:37 AM |
| | I agree with you. | | | |
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Pool Boy
Laurl, MD (DC suburb)
Master of Wine
Posts:13711
| | 11/23/2002 8:58 PM |
| I would tend to think that many things make up what a given individual believes to be excellent and terrible wine. Educating your tastebuds is certainly part of it, and what your past experiences have been certainly play a part. But, I would also agree that there are just some things people don't and may never like.
BUT, I must also say that people tastes can and do change. For example, as a kid, I could only stand tomatoes if they were in katchup or tomato soup form. Now, I LOVE tomatoes. Couldn't the same thing happen with a person's tastes in wine? | |
www.roguefood.com -- www.cellartracker.com | |
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Joseph Bembry
Wine Lover
Posts:4875
| | 11/23/2002 9:03 PM |
| Absolutely TJ, my palate has evolved tremndously in the past 2-3 yrs. I never liked Cabs when I first started drinking wine. Only Pinot and Zinfandel for reds. Now, I enjoy every flavor under the sun. 
jb | | | |
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Pool Boy
Laurl, MD (DC suburb)
Master of Wine
Posts:13711
| | 11/23/2002 9:10 PM |
| INdeed, jb. I am having quirky thoughts about cabs, lately. I am just not in to them.
Don't get me wrong, I love the juice, but I have wandered into other realms presently. I actually prefer blends with cab than a largely straight up cab. But that is me as of right now, I am sure if I ever had a real world-class cab I might be changing my mind. | |
www.roguefood.com -- www.cellartracker.com | |
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JonesWineNo1
Sommelier
Posts:8568
| | 11/24/2002 4:24 PM |
| Not considering Cabernet king is hardly something to worry about. Cabernet is popular for many reasons not the least of which is its reliable flavor profile. Its consistentency lends itself to appreciation which begets more Cabernet and so on.
I, for one, agree with you. Cabernet except in its highest manifestation is not the most interesting wine to drink imo. Frankly, it is not even close. | | | |
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Pool Boy
Laurl, MD (DC suburb)
Master of Wine
Posts:13711
| | 11/24/2002 9:26 PM |
| Jones, that, of course begs the question -- What do you find to be the most interesting wine to drink?
For me, I think it is Pinot Noir. | |
www.roguefood.com -- www.cellartracker.com | |
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Joseph Bembry
Wine Lover
Posts:4875
| | 11/24/2002 9:27 PM |
| No need to ask me that question. We all know the answer. 
jb | | | |
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love_cab_chard
Master of Wine
Posts:12497
| | 11/24/2002 9:33 PM |
| | Cabernet (even with the beating it is taking in this topic). | | | |
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JonesWineNo1
Sommelier
Posts:8568
| | 11/25/2002 3:08 AM |
| | Pinot Noir followed closely by Syrah. | | | |
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Pool Boy
Laurl, MD (DC suburb)
Master of Wine
Posts:13711
| | 11/25/2002 2:25 PM |
| Jones--
I know I am verring slightly off topic here, but, which Syrahs do you tend to prefer? Those from France (I am assuming this is the case), California, Australia or elsewhere? | |
www.roguefood.com -- www.cellartracker.com | |
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JonesWineNo1
Sommelier
Posts:8568
| | 11/25/2002 2:46 PM |
| | All three areas produce Syrahs I am happy to have in my cellar (as does Italy nowadays don't miss the 98/99 Ciacci or any Scrio for instance). I have more Australian Shiraz than anything else. Cote Rotie is my favorite area in France and can make the best of the best. Santa Barbara Syrah shows incredible promise and some of my favorite wines of all time come from Santa Barbara (Sine Qua Non Against the Wall Syrah and Queen of Spades). After thinking about it, my favorite area is Santa Barbara County Syrah. It is a pleasant blend of the Northern Rhone and Australia. | | | |
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ChangeMe
Barrel Filler
Posts:1010
| | 11/25/2002 3:16 PM |
| This is a bit off of the differing tastes of wine lovers but I think it is relevant especially to sensitivity to brett and TCA. I saw an article recently that discussed why some people could eat food and salsa with little effect that others find akin to eating lava. It has a lot to do with the amount of taste buds per square inch on the individual tasters tongue.
It discussed in detail how people who are able to enjoy extremely hot foods isn’t so much that they like it that hot, it’s that they don’t perceive it as being as hot as some others do.
I’m not sure if this relates across to wine sensitivity but it seems logical that it would.
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TCK
Barrel Filler
Posts:1279
| | 11/25/2002 4:29 PM |
| I believe anticipation can also effect a tasting session. The psychology of it is that when I am impressed by something that I have been waiting to try the emotional happiness and satisfaction can lead to a more complete appreciation of the wine therefore leading to a higher score from me. Conversely, a poor showing from an anticipated bottle is an emotional let down. The tasting experience becomes less enjoyable therefore I can subconsciously be led to give a lower rating.
The point is that scientifically speaking there is a higher standard deviation for wines that I score that I am anxious to try due to an emotional factor.
TCK
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