Chris  
Grape Sorter
Posts: 246
 | | 05-04-2005 02:51 AM |
| We're moving into our first house of our own next week. I've researched wine storage options rather exhaustively in anticipation of the move. The posts here have been quite helpful too. The thing is, after moving, painting, new carpeting, all new furniture, new furnace, etc., there's little money left for a decent 250-500 capacity unit right now. I anticipate reaching about 500 bottles in a couple of years. Until now, I've taken advantage of a near constant 56 degree, dark and humid basement of the house we rent. What's the next best thing to spending more money I don't have and doing it right with a proper unit? I have an extra refrigerator and also a half-size refrigerator and I'm considering trying my luck with the WineStat for now. It's been mentioned here in previous threads but otherwise gets very little notice. Any suggestions on this or other options? I'd rather not continue to store wine on racks in a dark corner of this much newer and possibly less accommodating basement. Thanks. | | |
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David Niederauer
Los Gatos, CA
Master Sommelier
Posts: 15756
| | 05-04-2005 03:16 AM |
| The only other option I see here is to go rob a bank  . | | | |
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wineismylife 
Arlington, TX
Master of Wine
Posts: 12412
| | 05-04-2005 12:47 PM |
| | I know I sound like I'm beating a dead horse as well but I still recommend that you cut your wine purchases to at least half of what they currently are and buy as much storage space NOW as you can possibly afford. Once acquired, paid for and available to store your precious gems then you can resume buying. This is a marathon, not a sprint. | | | Joe-----Wine is like potato chips around me...if it's open, it's gone. | |
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Tom
Barrel Sampler
Posts: 2384
| | 05-04-2005 12:51 PM |
| crafty
Congrats on the first house. That is great and I am certain you will love it.
Get used to no money not that you own a house.
You should be used to no money since you drink wine.
If you think anticipate getting to 500 bottles in a few years, you better start planning for 1000. The fact that you have no money is irrelevant.
If you do put in a cellar, be sure you get a disproportionate number of slots for Burgandy sized bottles.
Whatever you do, it will be wrong and will need to be redone at even more additional expense. It won't matter as you will be hooked.
Surrender now and as noted above, go rob a bank.
Congrats on the house!
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Budman
Philly Suburbs
VinoCellar.com Extraordinaire
Posts: 23630
| | 05-04-2005 01:12 PM |
| Quote:
Whatever you do, it will be wrong and will need to be redone at even more additional expense. It won't matter as you will be hooked.
WDoT... This may be the truest statement I've ever seen on this (or any other) board!!!   | | | |
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Pool Boy
Laurl, MD (DC suburb)
Master of Wine
Posts: 13767
| | 05-04-2005 01:28 PM |
| Quote:
I know I sound like I'm beating a dead horse as well but I still recommend that you cut your wine purchases to at least half of what they currently are and buy as much storage space NOW as you can possibly afford. Once acquired, paid for and available to store your precious gems then you can resume buying. This is a marathon, not a sprint.
This is good advice. Maybe I ought to follow it.
Question. For these big ass storage units (say 300, 500 bottles or more, do you need to have a separate circuit put in to feed the electricity for the cooling unit? Or does this stuff just get plugged in to the wall?
And, realistically speaking, how many bottles can you really fill in a given sized unit? Say how many can fit in a Eurocave xxx # of bottle unit? What about a vintage keeper x # bottle unit? Etc? | | | www.roguefood.com -- www.cellartracker.com | |
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wineismylife
Arlington, TX
Master of Wine
Posts: 12412
| | 05-04-2005 01:40 PM |
| TJ, you rarely need a separate circuit unless we're talking multiple units. The manufacturers basically recommend you plug them into their own outlet is all.
It is really hard to predict how much you can cram into any given unit. Factors such as shelving design, bottle sizes being stored, etc... can vary things greatly. As a rule bulk storage takes less space and allows maximum storage. Racking is convenient but is wasteful. You generally balance the two. IMO if you end up plus or minus within 10% of your theoretical maximum storage limit consider yourself lucky. | | | Joe-----Wine is like potato chips around me...if it's open, it's gone. | |
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Pool Boy
Laurl, MD (DC suburb)
Master of Wine
Posts: 13767
| | 05-04-2005 01:49 PM |
| | SO I should probably only really count on 75-80% of the advertised amount, then huh? | | | www.roguefood.com -- www.cellartracker.com | |
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Tom
Barrel Sampler
Posts: 2384
| | 05-04-2005 01:53 PM |
| tj
We just plugged ours in.
Of course, all the lights in the neighborhood went off, but we all must make sacrifices.
Mine is supposed to hold almost 500. I don't think so. By the time you have oversized bottles, extra long bottles, mags, etc., you end up with fewer tha you'd hoped. At least in my case I did.
It is never enough. We are all sick people. | | | |
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Chris
Grape Sorter
Posts: 246
| | 05-04-2005 03:30 PM |
| I love this board!
Great advice, all, especially from Dave about robbing a bank. And I appreciate the sentiments from WIML, Bud, Tom and Thomas- sage advice indeed. You've all confirmed what my gut has been telling me in spite of what my wallet says- a proper storage unit is what I need. I'm still intrigued though about the WineStat unit and modifying my extra refrigerators for now. It might be a viable short term fix until I can recover from the new house/new everything expenses. Does anyone have any experience with these contraptions? The testimomnials on their website suggest it's the greatest thing since sliced bread. Otherwise, living in "BF" Ohio limits my cabinet/cooler purchase choices other than mail ordering a unit such as a Vintage Keeper. I'm also uncomfortable with the notion of dropping three grand or more on a (noisy?) piece of furniture whose cooling unit is warrateed for only five years. Yeah, this is a sickness. My next quandary will be asking for advice on how I can convince my Lovely Bride that the expense is worth it. | | | |
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Dick W.
Barrel Filler
Posts: 1081
| | 05-04-2005 04:07 PM |
| | given your screen name, i would suggest putting the craft portion to work and building your own cellar. there are several threads here on how to go about that. by you purchasing materials and putting in sweat equity, you could build a cellar for perhaps 4-5G that holds considerably more than some refridgerated unit. space concerns taken care of, voila. WDoT is correct, the vino laws cannot be altered, if you build a 2k cellar, you'll have 2.5K bottles. surrender, plus move out of OH to a real wine loving state that sells vino without making the purchaser feel like a hostage, or a criminal! | | | |
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Tom
Barrel Sampler
Posts: 2384
| | 05-04-2005 04:33 PM |
| Quote:
I.............My next quandary will be asking for advice on how I can convince my Lovely Bride that the expense is worth it.
Some evening, open a 1996 Cristal, have a wondeful meal prepared and at the end of the meal, explain that was your last bottle of that wonderful Champagne. You just have no where to store any more in a proper fashion. What to do honey? What to do?"
That assumes she likes Champagne. Or dessert wine (SORRY davidn, SWEET wine). Etc. Etc.
If she doesn't drink, well, then you better live up to your name.
Good luck.
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wineismylife
Arlington, TX
Master of Wine
Posts: 12412
| | 05-04-2005 06:08 PM |
| If you have a basement in the new home you can buy a Wine Room for the lowest cost per bottle storage ability EXCEPT building a custom cellar yourself in said basement. FWIW.
I believe LCC has experience with the Wine Stat if he'd care to share his experience. | | | Joe-----Wine is like potato chips around me...if it's open, it's gone. | |
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wineismylife
Arlington, TX
Master of Wine
Posts: 12412
| | 05-04-2005 06:11 PM |
| | BTW TJ, your guideline might be incorrect as well. For instance, I have a free standing cellar in my kitchen that is designed to hold only 120 bottles max and I've had it up to 128 a couple of times. You just never know until you start cramming stuff into it and one day declare "oh crap, I have no place to but this bottle". That's your maximum. | | | Joe-----Wine is like potato chips around me...if it's open, it's gone. | |
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Pool Boy
Laurl, MD (DC suburb)
Master of Wine
Posts: 13767
| | 05-04-2005 08:17 PM |
| Quote:
I believe LCC has experience with the Wine Stat if he'd care to share his experience.
I was gonna say that. If he doesn't happen upon the thread, PM him.
Ideally, if Mrs. TJ and I stay put in our current house, I'd like to convert all or part of a closet or room to a wine storage space with its own cooling unit. I think I'd get the most space and thus the best $spent per bottle of storage capacity. This would of course be rolled in to the cost of the house remodel, right? | | | www.roguefood.com -- www.cellartracker.com | |
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Budman
Philly Suburbs
VinoCellar.com Extraordinaire
Posts: 23630
| | 05-04-2005 08:25 PM |
| | A built-in closet wine cellar should appreciate the value of your house. Get down to Home Depot and get started!!!! | | | |
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ChangeMe
Grape Stomper
Posts: 190
| | 05-05-2005 12:50 AM |
| | Another thing you can do is give your wife a fur coat, then drop the temp on your a/c unit to about 50 degrees; bam! Instant cellar. If she returns the fur coat, rent the movie Heat with DeNiro and Pacino, take notes, then rob a bank. | | | |
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Rothko
Palm Beach
Wine Connoisseur
Posts: 5706
| | 05-05-2005 09:31 PM |
| Quote:
Another thing you can do is give your wife a fur coat, then drop the temp on your a/c unit to about 50 degrees; bam! Instant cellar. If she returns the fur coat, rent the movie Heat with DeNiro and Pacino, take notes, then rob a bank.
Yeah, because that bank robbery was textbook. | | | |
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ChangeMe
Grape Sorter
Posts: 307
| | 05-07-2005 12:38 PM |
| crafty,
all great advice. let me give you my short story since this may is my 3rd year buying, drinking and storing wine. i went and bought a 200 bottle rack for the cool dark corner of my new house. i thought that this would be all the storage i would ever need. needless to say i was wrong and within 3 months i decided to build a walk-in cellar. this entailed finishing the whole basement. my wife viewed this as the perfect opportunity to get the entire basement done. i did the construction of the entire basement and cellar by myself with help from my father and a few guys i know. the only thing i paid for was the framing of the basement. i figured i could do it myself but the guy i hired was already building me a deck and it took him all of 2 days to frame the whole thing out. oh and the carpert was put down by someone who owned me some money for fixing his car the cellar itself wasn't that hard. there are books out there on it. the one book i found most helpful was written by a guy named gold. i think the name was "how and why to build a wine cellar". everything turned out great and my initial investment was pretty low including racking and the cooloing unit. the only thing i wish i did in hindsight, was build it bigger good luck and remember that proper storage imo is most essential before starting a collection. don't worry about missing out on current great wines or vintages, there will always be more. get the storage issue taken care of first 
btw, i went from no bottles 3 years ago to now having almost 1000, not too mention all that has been drunk, sold or given away. this hobby is absolutely addicting | | | |
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David Niederauer
Los Gatos, CA
Master Sommelier
Posts: 15756
| | 05-07-2005 05:35 PM |
| Quote:
...I'm still intrigued though about the WineStat unit and modifying my extra refrigerators for now...
How large is the refrig?
Keep in mind stacking your bottles up is not the best way to be able to find what you want. You would need to build in some sort of racking system.
I would think that the cost of the thermostat (how much is it) would be almost as much as a small wine-refrig holding about 60 bottles. You should be able to find a unit like this at your local Costco for around $200 or even less (of course if you line in the SF Bay Area don't you dare go to Costco for an appliance!).
Quote:
...living in "BF" Ohio limits my cabinet/cooler purchase choices other than mail orderin...
Columbus (aka BF) used to have one of the largest refrigerator plants in the world; Westinghouse, then Frigidaire, and most recently Amana. Are those all gone now? | | | |
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