Jeremy Matthew
Barrel Sampler
Posts:2067
 | | 09/25/2003 2:48 AM |
| Having just read Otis's comments on the Andrew Murray and Boardo's Vino Con Brio notes in the past, I have a couple of questions.
1- Is Viognier particularly common in the US/California?
2- Has it been aorund long?
3- What are the better ones (other than those listed above.)?
TIA. | | | |
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skwid
Wine Connoisseur
Posts:5452
| | 09/25/2003 2:59 AM |
| In answer to your questions:
1). no
2). no
3). I'm sure others will chime in as I don't drink much of the stuff. I do like the Pride though (it is expensive $40/bottle). | | | |
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love_cab_chard
Master of Wine
Posts:12352
| | 09/25/2003 3:02 AM |
| I like:
a. 00 Chateau St. Jean Sonoma County Estate Vineyard about $30.00.
b. 01 Gregory Graham Napa Valley about $14.00 (see MudPuppy).
I posted TNs on both of these.
I agree, not a common grape. | | | |
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Jeremy Matthew
Barrel Sampler
Posts:2067
| | 09/25/2003 3:06 AM |
| I remember that thread LCC about the St Jean Viognier. You gave it a pretty good score -90-92 I think ( I'll do a search.), you thought it was pretty awesome as I recall.
Yeah -92 points and some of the comments made for interesting reading.
Not to cheap for this grape variety though.
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ChangeMe
Master of Wine
Posts:11169
| | 09/25/2003 3:12 AM |
| | Failla Jordan is the best I've had. Vino Con Brio a close second. | | | |
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Sacred Cow
Wine Thief
Posts:2764
| | 09/25/2003 3:12 AM |
| I agree with Board-O and skwid. The VcB is great, and at a great price. The Pride is also great, a small step up, but not worth the difference in price (to me).
Mike | | | |
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Bob Bressler
Napa Valley
Wine Lover
Posts:4809
| | 09/25/2003 4:01 AM |
| | I enjoy the Araujo | | | |
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love_cab_chard
Master of Wine
Posts:12352
| | 09/25/2003 12:29 PM |
| Forgot that 1. Failla Jordan is very good also.
Bressler, Araujo makes Viognier??? | | | |
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ChangeMe
Grape Fermenter
Posts:672
| | 09/25/2003 1:36 PM |
| Jeremy,
I enjoy a nice California Viognier with light and/or aromatic dishes, like steamed trout with fresh herbs or carrot-ginger soup. There is something very "sunny" about these wines that lifts the spirits. My wife absolutely loves the stuff.
In general, CA viognier is less floral than Condrieus from the Rhone, and tropical fruit flavors are more prominent. CA viogniers also tend to be a bit weightier or creamy in the mouth. Almost without exception, they should be consumed within 2 years of the vintage date, as the fruit has pretty much left the building at the three year mark.
Decent viognier usually costs at least $18/bottle here, most likely $25-$35. Pride (around $40) makes the best CA viognier I've tried, with Vino Con Brio, Alban, Calera, and Eberle in the next tier. The VCB and Eberle are priced under $20 and are excellent values. Of the cheapie viogniers (under $15), RW Philips EXP and Echelon are decent examples.
Are they making any viognier yet over in NZ? I've tried a couple unremarkable Aussie versions. Can't remember the producers. Can you you recommend any good ones from there?
Cheers,
Otis
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Eric White
San Ramon, CA
Advanced Sommelier
Posts:9126
| | 09/25/2003 2:47 PM |
| | IMO, Pride makes the finest Viognier in California, but it'll cost ya. Vino Con Brio is suprisingly similar in style, and at about 1/3 the cost it is a screaming value. Another producer of note is Copain, with their "Caties Corner" viognier, which is excellent. | | | |
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Winetex
Austin, Texas
Master of Wine
Posts:10573
| | 09/25/2003 2:49 PM |
| | Darioush's viognier is also good but it will also cost you $28-35. | | | |
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ChangeMe
Grape Fermenter
Posts:667
| | 09/25/2003 5:05 PM |
| | Agree with Winetex. | | | |
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Stefania Wine
San Jose, CA
Grape Puncher
Posts:725
| | 09/25/2003 5:35 PM |
| As of 2001 there was @ 1600 bearing acres and 350 non bearing. There have been a pretty consistant 100-200 additional acres planted every year for the last 4-5.
IMHO there's a bit of a crisis going on right now. Every class I've been to at Davis they have cautioned specifically about planting Viognier on any scale. Right now prices are very attractive for growers, especially compared with Chard prices that are going through the floor.
Growers are seeing the $1500/ton price for Viognier and the Chard price hitting $300-$400 and making a basic choice. Out goes the Chard in goes the Viognier. The problem they've cautioned about in the classes, is that the retail market isn't reflecting that. Right now, and maybe always, Viognier is a specialty niche wine for consumers, and does not have broad apeal. (Think box and bar here before you correct me about how much your Aunt Flo likes it).
One Ag rep said "If you put in 100 acres of Viognier, you'll be out there all alone and probably depress the market all by yourself." And that's the crisis. I suspect, that growers just won't think that way. And I bet when I see the 2002 and 2003 crush reports, planted acres will be 400-500 additional, and we'll have a Viognier glut come 2005-2006.
Now personally I really like Viognier. The best I've had from the state include:
Pride Mountain
Cooper Garrod
G.Green Napa Valley
Also I enjoy the RIpken Vineyard in Lodi a great deal and you can try a bunch of producers including:
Vino Con Brio
Rosenblum
Thomas Coyne (labeled California, but it comes from Ripken)
JC Cellars (A late harvest type)
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Paul Romero - Owner/Winemaker Stefania Wine
www.stefaniawine.com | |
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Jeremy Matthew
Barrel Sampler
Posts:2067
| | 09/26/2003 12:51 AM |
| Firstly thank you so much for the information.
I've made a small list that will be added to the ever growing pile of US wines to try. VCB is on the top of the list simply because Vitis and I e-mail each other and I always wish to try an aquintance's wine over other wines.
Winetex,
I remember your notes on the Dourish- yum.
Otis,
NZ has only 15 ha of Viognier planted while Aussie has around 200 ha planted. Most of the Aussie Viognier is used in Shiraz based wines. IN NZ the three most prominant labels are -
Te Mata- one of the better wines
Milton- A little one dimensional for my liking
Odessey - Pretty smart wine
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Pool Boy
Laurl, MD (DC suburb)
Master of Wine
Posts:13660
| | 09/26/2003 9:25 PM |
| | I'll third winetex's comment on the Darioush. I've had it once and it was great, IIRC. | |
www.roguefood.com -- www.cellartracker.com | |
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Randy Sloan
St. Helena
Barrel Sampler
Posts:2054
| | 09/30/2003 12:54 AM |
| | Greg Graham, the winemaker at Rombauer, makes a nice, reasonably priced Viognier under his own label. | |
Randy Sloan
Match Vineyards | |
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GATC
Barrel Sampler
Posts:2420
| | 10/01/2003 12:46 AM |
| | I enjoyed the nose on the Acacia - very clean fruit and flowers. I've enjoyed the Darioush as well. I don't particularly care for most of them because there is a medicinal streak in them that reminds me of some Napa Valley chardonnays. | | | |
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Jeremy Matthew
Barrel Sampler
Posts:2067
| | 10/01/2003 4:07 AM |
| | Do they have very high alcohol? | | | |
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stemor
Collierville, TN
Wine Thief
Posts:2813
| | 10/01/2003 5:05 AM |
| Jeremy,
As examples, the 2001 Darioush is 14.0%, 2001 Ripken Vineyard from Rosenblum is 14.6% and the same vineyard from Vino Con Brio (VV's winery) is 15.0%.
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Cheers, y'all | |
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ChangeMe
Master of Wine
Posts:11169
| | 10/01/2003 2:04 PM |
| | Yeah, but they hide it well. | | | |
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