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ChangeMe
Grape Picker
Posts:23
 | | 01/23/2007 12:11 AM |
| Your brilliant newb was in the shower this morning and out of the blue, a crazy idea popped into his young, green head.
If you are "familiar" with a particular bottle, say it takes on average 2 hours to "open" up because its a "youngen", and you wanted to get down to business without the wait, couldnt you accelerate the process with one of these??
crap, I cant seem to figure out how to insert a picture here.
Oh well, cant you accelerate the process using a blender?
Yes, its not as elegant as using a decanter, and perhaps, some of the "experience" is in the patience and waiting, but from a conceptual standpoint, if the objective is to maximize contact with air, wouldnt a blender on high for 30 sec or so do it?
If not, please justify. Does it break down the properties, does it become mayonaise (like blending oil), you know.. teach the dumb newbie.
your future bordeaux party host, who will bust out a blender..
VinoNewb | | | |
| Pete Marsh
Left Coast
Barrel Filler
Posts:1423
| | 01/23/2007 1:02 AM |
| WNB:
You are most welcome to put your wine in a blender and blend away. However, you would have a great tasting oak drink that looked like grape juice. Fruit flavors and aromas are keys elements in wine enjoyment. Every hostile action that creates a chemical-like reaction (heat light aggitation) in the wine demishes the fruit quality of the wine. On my first crush 56 years ago, my grandfather taught me that any extra movement of the wine creates a diminished fruit level. When you visit a winery you will find that the top winemakers are very gentle with the grapes from crush to bottle because rough handling causes them to "pay with fruit." Using a blender will just kill your fruit because you are accelerating the chemical reaction. Most decanting is done to separate the sediment and raise the temperature to start the aroma and flavor enjoyemnt. Blending of delicate wines will ruin them. But it is your call - try it if you do not like wine with fruit flaovors or aromas. | |
Intaxication: Euphoria at getting a tax refund, which lasts until you realize it was your money to start with. | |
| ChangeMe
Grape Picker
Posts:23
| | 01/23/2007 1:45 AM |
| I figured it wouldnt be warmly accepted, but just wanted to know why. Maybe I should change my handle to "Y". I love to ask and know why things are the way they are.
Thanks for your thoughts. | | | |
| wineismylife
Arlington, TX
Master of Wine
Posts:11872
| | 01/23/2007 4:09 AM |
| | I have a "Y". Why is your account still active? | |
Joe
-----
Wine is like potato chips around me...if it's open, it's gone. | |
| Rothko
Palm Beach
Wine Thief
Posts:2843
| | 01/23/2007 3:49 PM |
| I am getting flashbacks to BellaDonna...
Putting wine in a blender... | | | |
| Dave Tong
Santa Clara, CA
Barrel Filler
Posts:1331
| | 01/23/2007 11:53 PM |
| Mark Neal swears by pouring a glass, putting the cork in and shaking it vigorously.
I've never tried it, but a side-by-side comparison would be interesting.
I have a funnel that sprays the wine out through six holes down the side of the decanter to maximise aeration. | |
http://scmwine.blogspot.com - My wine blog.
http://scmwine.wikispaces.com - your guide to the Santa Cruz Mountains and Santa Clara Valley
| |
| ChangeMe
Grape Picker
Posts:23
| | 01/24/2007 1:02 AM |
| Hmmm.
I guess this is another "decant or not to decant" type scenarios, and there are two camps here as well.
So, maybe the blender is a little too aggressive, but perhaps the light agitation may or may not be such a bad thing?
Thanks for your thoughts Dave.
Any others?
 | | | |
| Pete Marsh
Left Coast
Barrel Filler
Posts:1423
| | 01/24/2007 2:09 AM |
| Mark Neal makes cab and zin. These are not delicate wines. Pinot noir is my favorite and I disagree with Mr. Neal - most older, delicate wines will suffer from this treatment.
Pete | |
Intaxication: Euphoria at getting a tax refund, which lasts until you realize it was your money to start with. | |
| Al_ksyrah
Barrel Filler
Posts:1023
| | 01/24/2007 4:20 AM |
| I had the impression that Mark Neal advocated this method for young wines. Obviously doesn't work well for a wine that has thrown a sediment (in addition to the problem you mentioned).
-Al | | | |
| cmsyrah
Grape Picker
Posts:0
| | 01/24/2007 6:44 AM |
| oh dear...harlan in a mixmaster.
So we need not worry anymore about UPS rocking over bumpy roads.....They are eliminating a step in aeration/decanting.
Next, we won't worry about temperatures when wines are shipped internationally which may take several months..
Maybe I need to go back to Scotch. No aggravation.
Good luck, Newb. | | | |
| ChangeMe
Grape Picker
Posts:23
| | 01/24/2007 7:16 AM |
| haha, no worries people.
Pete Marsh offered a personal experience with his grandfather that appears to be a reaonsable justification as to why aggressive forms of agitation would more or less damage or compromise a delicate wine. Understood and accepted as a reasonable position.
It seems thusfar that gentle agitation, such as "swishing around" would be acceptable, and hence this newb will adhere to the wisdom of the more experienced.
The blender theory was simply a thought, and I had a feeling it would be not be warmly accepted. I needed someone with a good enough reason to justify why it was an inappropriate method for accelerated aeration so in the future, I can also justify it as well.
Regards. | | | |
| ChangeMe
Grape Picker
Posts:23
| | 01/24/2007 7:24 AM |
| Oh yes,
One other important note.
As a newb, I bring fresh new ideas, and challenge the old guard. Why things are done the way they are.
If you can't justify why something is the way it is, then perhaps there is a better method/way. I am a GREAT proponent of continuous improvement, and hence this should be no different.
My posts are never intended to insult. They may challenge the status quo, but without this, there can never be improvements. Also, in the process, I learn WHY things are the way they are in the world of fine wines. (a new hobby of mine)
Someone I highly respect told me that "if you cannot explain/justify something, you really do not understand it that well yourself". I have faith in this statement, and wish to be well educated by the community here that is willing to share their experiences.
I hope this brings some insight as to why I ask some of the questions I do. I think it's helpful from both fronts.
Regards, | | | |
| Pete Marsh
Left Coast
Barrel Filler
Posts:1423
| | 01/24/2007 3:05 PM |
| Quote:
Oh yes,
One other important note.
As a newb, I bring fresh new ideas, and challenge the old guard. Why things are done the way they are.
If you can't justify why something is the way it is, then perhaps there is a better method/way. I am a GREAT proponent of continuous improvement, and hence this should be no different.
My posts are never intended to insult. They may challenge the status quo, but without this, there can never be improvements. Also, in the process, I learn WHY things are the way they are in the world of fine wines. (a new hobby of mine)
Someone I highly respect told me that "if you cannot explain/justify something, you really do not understand it that well yourself". I have faith in this statement, and wish to be well educated by the community here that is willing to share their experiences.
I hope this brings some insight as to why I ask some of the questions I do. I think it's helpful from both fronts.
Regards,
Dear WNB:
I would not mind you challenging the status quo if you had any idea of what the status quo was or what you were suggesting had not been thought of and answered numerous times before.
I think that you benefit yourself by getting a more knowledge of wine by:
• Drinking wine and posting tasting notes
• Visiting a winery especially during crush
• Visiting a vineyard during the growing season
• Reading some of the really great reference books
Here are some of my favorites:
Sunlight into Wine ($39 –UC Davis Bookstore or Amazon)
The Wine Bible by Karen MacNeil ($13.57 - Amazon)
The University Wine Course ($24.15 – Amazon)
Wine Taster’s Secrets: The Consumer’s Guide to Wine Tasting (do a Google Search)
After you finish these, you will find out why most winemakers prefer certain types of pumps without blades (like the blades in the blender you mentioned) so as not to damage wine when they move it.
Good luck in your search for wine knowledge. | |
Intaxication: Euphoria at getting a tax refund, which lasts until you realize it was your money to start with. | |
| JimmyV
Central Connecticut
Wine Lover
Posts:4982
| | 01/24/2007 8:16 PM |
| Quote:
They may challenge the status quo, but without this, there can never be improvements. ...
Someone I highly respect told me that "if you cannot explain/justify something, you really do not understand it that well yourself".
This is hogwash. A personal lack of understanding does not signify a universal, or industry-wide lack of understanding. Just because I don't fully understand and can't verbally explain the entire process of how my car's brake system works is no reason for me to "challenge the status quo" by advocating drilling two holes in the footwell of my car so that I can pop my feet through and try stopping the vehiclea la Fred Flintstone. | |
Beta testing a new signature. | |
| Dave Tong
Santa Clara, CA
Barrel Filler
Posts:1331
| | 01/24/2007 10:18 PM |
| Quote:
Quote:
They may challenge the status quo, but without this, there can never be improvements. ...
Someone I highly respect told me that "if you cannot explain/justify something, you really do not understand it that well yourself".
This is hogwash. A personal lack of understanding does not signify a universal, or industry-wide lack of understanding.
Who's saying it does? | |
http://scmwine.blogspot.com - My wine blog.
http://scmwine.wikispaces.com - your guide to the Santa Cruz Mountains and Santa Clara Valley
| |
| JimmyV
Central Connecticut
Wine Lover
Posts:4982
| | 01/24/2007 10:36 PM |
| It's all right here:
Quote:
If you can't justify why something is the way it is, then perhaps there is a better method/way. I am a GREAT proponent of continuous improvement, and hence this should be no different.
Inherent in the rambling is the notion that progress comes from challenging convention, and that posing numerous inquiries that question the status quo is a fair way to test that staus quo. The fallacy is that instead of asking questions and testing the status quo, the better approach might be to learn more about that which you are challenging.
The inability to justify something does not make it challengable in and of itself. It simply means that you need to do more homework to cure your inability to justify. | |
Beta testing a new signature. | |
| ChangeMe
Grape Picker
Posts:14
| | 01/24/2007 11:48 PM |
| I'm a wine newb also. *ducks for cover*
Besides the sources listed above, one of the most valuable things I've used for learning is the search feature on this board and eBob. Anytime I have a question about something, there are usually countless threads dedicated to it, and those discussions have already taken place.
There is a wealth of free information out there. I feel lucky to be able to have such resources at this early point in my wine drinking "career". | | | |
| ChangeMe
Grape Picker
Posts:23
| | 01/25/2007 12:26 AM |
| Quote:
Quote:
They may challenge the status quo, but without this, there can never be improvements. ...
Someone I highly respect told me that "if you cannot explain/justify something, you really do not understand it that well yourself".
This is hogwash. A personal lack of understanding does not signify a universal, or industry-wide lack of understanding. Just because I don't fully understand and can't verbally explain the entire process of how my car's brake system works is no reason for me to "challenge the status quo" by advocating drilling two holes in the footwell of my car so that I can pop my feet through and try stopping the vehiclea la Fred Flintstone.
I'm sorry you are taking this a little more dramatically than intended. My point was, be somewhat intelligent about why something is the way it is. If there isnt a good enough reason, perhaps there is room for improvement. End of Story.
As an clearly claimed newb, I dont know why using a blender would be such a bad thing for the purposes of the original topic, accelerating the aeration process. My logic was, the grapes were crushed to make the wine anyway, who cares? A poster by Pete Marsh explained why (a reason) to not damage the grapes so to speak as it makes the properties (taste) change. Fair Enough.
Regarding your example, I see absolutely no correlation to the type of inquiry I had made. It is clear from some of the other discussions on this site that many things associated with wine consumption is subjective, and there are two camps to many points. How is this any different? I'm pretty sure that your quoted example is very one sided.
Happy Drinnking to you | | | |
| ChangeMe
Grape Picker
Posts:23
| | 01/25/2007 12:44 AM |
| Quote:
It's all right here:
Quote:
If you can't justify why something is the way it is, then perhaps there is a better method/way. I am a GREAT proponent of continuous improvement, and hence this should be no different.
Inherent in the rambling is the notion that progress comes from challenging convention, and that posing numerous inquiries that question the status quo is a fair way to test that staus quo. The fallacy is that instead of asking questions and testing the status quo, the better approach might be to learn more about that which you are challenging.
The inability to justify something does not make it challengable in and of itself. It simply means that you need to do more homework to cure your inability to justify.
To JimmyV,
Again, I'm sorry you consider these "ramblings". Please ignore my posts in the future if they offend you as such.
Regarding your points, it is definately true, and I strongly am a proponent of due dilligence by "doing one's homework" first, and than asking for help second.
However, trying to google Wine Blender, or Speed Decanting, or whatever creative phrases that convey the intended meaning, has and will likely in the near future result in wasted time and effort. Additionally, searching on this site for such phrases will result in unrelated matches.
As a result, under many different objectives and intentions:
1) start interacting with this community
2) try to make new friends which we can mutually learn and benefit from
3) to make a reader say, "hmm..... never thought of that..."
4) to make a reader say,"haha..."
and most importantly
5) ask in an environmemt which is the most likely to provide the best answer and justification (a wine focused forum). Most effective and most efficient.
I'm sure the lurkers and other newbs will be a little more hesistant to make such inquiries if they have fear to defend themselves by justifying their position. | | | |
| Dave Tong
Santa Clara, CA
Barrel Filler
Posts:1331
| | 01/25/2007 2:02 AM |
| Quote:
It's all right here:
Quote:
If you can't justify why something is the way it is, then perhaps there is a better method/way. I am a GREAT proponent of continuous improvement, and hence this should be no different.
Inherent in the rambling is the notion that progress comes from challenging convention, and that posing numerous inquiries that question the status quo is a fair way to test that staus quo. The fallacy is that instead of asking questions and testing the status quo, the better approach might be to learn more about that which you are challenging.
The inability to justify something does not make it challengable in and of itself. It simply means that you need to do more homework to cure your inability to justify.
I think that doing the homework is exactly why he posted his question. Where better to ask than in a community full of experts? All he's saying is "Conventional wisdom says that X is a bad idea. Can anyone explain to me why X is a bad idea, or is it just something that we all accept as fact?" And Pete has given him an explanation as to why it's a bad idea; a far better explanation than many of us could have given. | |
http://scmwine.blogspot.com - My wine blog.
http://scmwine.wikispaces.com - your guide to the Santa Cruz Mountains and Santa Clara Valley
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