ChillyWino
Barrel Racker
Posts:1649
 | | 07/27/2006 9:18 PM |
| | I thought I would move the discussion from "what are you drinking" to here. What are the differences between French and American Oak? Does it have a different effect on different grape types? | | | |
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JimmyV
Central Connecticut
Wine Lover
Posts:4982
| | 07/27/2006 9:37 PM |
| | This article will get you started. | |
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ChillyWino
Barrel Racker
Posts:1649
| | 07/27/2006 10:23 PM |
| Jimmy,
Great article, thanks!! Lots of great info.
This quote sums up what I was looking for.
"While both American and French oak contribute tannin and aroma, French oak contains more tannins and flavor components and has a less obviously “oaky” flavor and smell than American oak. American oak has a more aggressive mouthfeel and immediately apparent aroma. American oak contains more vanillin (vanilla aroma) and more odorous compounds." | | | |
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Vitis Vinifera
Grape Sorter
Posts:309
| | 07/28/2006 12:43 AM |
| I didn't read the article, but a few things come to mind
FO (french oak) comes from state-run forests which have been in place for centuries. Most FO forest were planted during France's earliest colonial period when they needed the wood for building ships. Anyways, their oak tends to be very consistent because of the management.
AO is often from (I think mostly) privately owned forests and may or may not be correclty managed, and you see more variability in oak effects between years.
Another thing is FO is tighter grained than AO, and thus the wine gets less oaky and can barrel age longer.
Of course the cost issue is there | | | |
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jason
Napa Valley
Wine Addict
Posts:6756
| | 07/28/2006 7:51 PM |
| | Just flavor profile wise, for my tastes French oak shows vanillin, cinnamon, nutmeg, cloves etc. American usually shows dill or baby coconut. | | | |
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JimmyV
Central Connecticut
Wine Lover
Posts:4982
| | 07/31/2006 1:49 PM |
| | Not living in Hawaii, or Florida, I can't say that I have any experience with the progression of coconuts over time. Can you describe as best as possible the diferences between baby and mature coconuts? When I buy a coconut in a grocery store, (a bit bigger than a softball, but smaller than a melon), is that a baby or mature coconut? | |
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Dave Tong
Santa Clara, CA
Barrel Filler
Posts:1331
| | 08/02/2006 1:37 AM |
| The best way to understand is to taste the same wine out of several different types of barrel.
A few different wineries do it but the best known is Del Dotto. It's expensive but worth doing once.
They also sell the wine in sets of 3 or 6 different ones, so if you don't plan on being in California any time soon and can rustle up enough like-minded friends then you may want to buy a set and organise your own tasting. | |
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Pete Marsh
Left Coast
Barrel Filler
Posts:1423
| | 08/02/2006 5:47 AM |
| A good friend of our fills his new barrels with water. He then tastes the water from these barrels and determines which barrels he will used for which wines. We were lucky enough to get asked to taste with him. The differences are amazing.
Also, we were in the Columbia Winery barrel room a couple of weeks ago. There were oak barrels in there from China and Poland as well as France & the US. | |
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davidandrose
Aurora, CO
Grape Puncher
Posts:924
| | 08/06/2006 9:14 PM |
| Quote:
The best way to understand is to taste the same wine out of several different types of barrel.
A few different wineries do it but the best known is Del Dotto. It's expensive but worth doing once.
They also sell the wine in sets of 3 or 6 different ones, so if you don't plan on being in California any time soon and can rustle up enough like-minded friends then you may want to buy a set and organise your own tasting.
The DelDotto tasting is pretty eye-opening. Two or so years ago we locally popped their horizontal of their cab aged in three different types of oak, and each had a completely different taste and profile. Highly recommended and educational. You can do the same out of barrel if you visit them. | | | |
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Rob Kim
Las Vegas, Nevada
Grape Sorter
Posts:225
| | 08/08/2006 8:59 PM |
| I could not agree more. My friend and I did the Del Dotto tour with Dave Del Dotto himself and it was truly educational. It was also over the top with all of the barrel samples. The differences between oak were staggering with the preferences for French Oak - of which he uses 6+ types. The American oak imparted an awkward heavy, caramelly type flavor profile that was clearly not as refined as the flavor profile of the French.
My favorites were the barrels used by Chateau Margaux (I forget the exact name) and the Cooper Select. The fact that the same wine can be made into six different tasting wines is remarkable.
The interesting thing (or gimmick I suppose) is that you can purchase the juice in the specific barrel. It's pricey, about $85 a bottle, but when combined with the experience, is worth it.
Also, the port is amazing, Cab Franc, Cab and Syrah (If I can actually remember all the details - it was late) - when blended, fantastic. The cognac we tasted to was electric - I actually preferred just inhaling it - it just shot up the nose - over drinking it.
Good times.
Rob | | | |
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