Chicago Wine Geek
Chicago Western Suburbs
Wine Labeler
Posts:3672
 | | 03/16/2005 4:27 PM |
| In reference to mailers, I've noticed that some VC members say that they will buy from the mailer to "support the winery".
I'm a little confused. When I got hooked on this wonderful habit, I signed up for every mailer that got good ratings in WS and WA. And I would buy a lot from mailers. I have posted in the past that I finally got smart and stopped buying blindly from mailers. When I bought some Fisher for $125 from the mailer and it showed up at $79 at the local wine store I got a lot more selective.
So now I only buy from a mailer if
A) I can't get it easily at retail - like Switchback, Harlan, etc.
or
B) If I can only find it at retail at a premium price - Shafer HSS (usually), Foley, etc. And premium price to me is 10% or more. So I pass on the Shafer cabernet mailer because I can find it for less but always buy the Relentless because I rarely find it cheaper than mailer price.
Anyway, to me, anytime I buy a bottle of wine I am supporting that winery. When I buy off a mailer, I am paying full list retail price - something I try not to do in real life. If mailer price on wine X is $100 and I can find it through wine-searcher.com for $80 net, why on earth would I pay $100 to "support the winery". Heck, that's the same as buying it at $80 and send the winery a check for $20. When a winery decides what price to sell their wine to a distributor, that number should be what they can live with in terms of profit. When that same wine sells on a mailer for a lot more, that's just gravy.
If I buy a case of wine at retail of winery X, I feel that I am fully supporting that winery.
Am I missing something here? | | | |
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Jhawkwino
Grape Sorter
Posts:264
| | 03/16/2005 4:31 PM |
| I think that when most people talk about "supporting the winery" with their direct orders, they are referring to the fact that the winery gets the full purchase price, rather than sharing with distributors and retailers. If I can get a wine for the same price (or nearly the same price) at retail or direct (taking shipping costs into consideration), I would like to buy from the winery. If a wine is available at retail at a substantial discount from mailing list price, I don't feel obligated to buy from the winery.
For me, this pretty much only applies to the smaller wineries. | | | |
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ChangeMe
Grape Truck Driver
Posts:44
| | 03/16/2005 4:33 PM |
| | Good points! Plus, you still have to pay shipping costs on top of the "retail" price that the winery charges you. I only buy from the mailing list if I can't get a wine at a retail outlet. | | | |
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JimmyV
Central Connecticut
Wine Connoisseur
Posts:5110
| | 03/16/2005 4:45 PM |
| | Simply stated, buying cheaper at retail benefits you. Buying at a premium from the winery benefits the winery. Whom you choose to benefit when parting with your money is entirely up to you. The added benefit to buying from the winery is that it ensures that you get the wine, and betters your chances of getting it again the following year. In addition, at least in theory, pumping additional capital into the winery through direct purchase improves the profit margin of the winery and increases its chances of surviving in a very tough business. But for wines like Shafer, none of these benefits seems to justify paying a premium for its basic Cabernet, unless, of course, big purchases of that wine move you up on the HSS list, and you are desirous of more bottles than you are currently allocated. | |
Beta testing a new signature. | |
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ChangeMe
Master of Wine
Posts:12891
| | 03/16/2005 5:24 PM |
| jimmy,
the only problem is these so called profits the wineries are getting are only resulting in higher prices to the consumer. i am not complaining because i am a free market type of guy. i just buy as much as i can retail. | | | |
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ChangeMe
Barrel Filler
Posts:1371
| | 03/16/2005 5:44 PM |
| | Supporting the winery can also extend to supporting the wineries of people who post here for example or that people otherwise know. | | | |
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dinwiddie
Barrel Sampler
Posts:2177
| | 03/16/2005 5:44 PM |
| | I only buy from mailers when I can't find the wine at retail. Given that I like to buy small production wines, often buying from the mailer is the only way I can get the wine at all. | | | |
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kpak
Alaska
Wine Thief
Posts:2968
| | 03/16/2005 5:59 PM |
| | yes, what dinwiddie said. | |
The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has it's limits...
ps - friends don't let friends eat farmed salmon. | |
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Chicago Wine Geek
Chicago Western Suburbs
Wine Labeler
Posts:3672
| | 03/16/2005 6:13 PM |
| Quote:
Supporting the winery can also extend to supporting the wineries of people who post here for example or that people otherwise know.
I bought all I was allocated of Bressler and then some. I try to do the same with Pax, Neal, and Carlisle. But when those start showing up at retail for $20 under mailer, I will need rethink those as well.
I'll also buy direct at a higher price to have access to larger format bottles. | | | |
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Al HooKoo
Las Vegas, NV
Barrel Filler
Posts:1355
| | 03/16/2005 6:32 PM |
| I prefer to 'support the winery' for several reasons;
Most of the wines I want are not found at retail and are usually sold out from the mailing list in the first place.
By visiting and getting to know the winemakers, I get to learn from them, buy exclusive wines not available anywhere else and I have been given wines they have been experimenting with.
I prefer to buy my wine directly from the winery because of quality control.
I don't believe most of the wine sold at retail in Las Vegas was transported across the desert in temperature controlled vehicles. I have no idea how long the wine has been sitting under the warm bright lights of the store. That being said, I do have a neighborhood wine shop, whose owner I know and trust and I buy wine from. | | | |
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GreenDrazi
Atlanta, GA
Grape Puncher
Posts:938
| | 03/16/2005 6:33 PM |
| | And sometimes we buy direct in lieu of retail so that we can get a shot at reserves which are not available at all via retail. | | | |
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Chicago Wine Geek
Chicago Western Suburbs
Wine Labeler
Posts:3672
| | 03/16/2005 6:43 PM |
| Quote:
I prefer to 'support the winery' for several reasons;
Most of the wines I want are not found at retail and are usually sold out from the mailing list in the first place.
By visiting and getting to know the winemakers, I get to learn from them, buy exclusive wines not available anywhere else and I have been given wines they have been experimenting with.
I prefer to buy my wine directly from the winery because of quality control.
Those are exactly the same reasons I buy direct from mailers. | | | |
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ChangeMe
Barrel Filler
Posts:1273
| | 03/16/2005 8:16 PM |
| Quote:
I prefer to 'support the winery' for several reasons;
Most of the wines I want are not found at retail and are usually sold out from the mailing list in the first place.
By visiting and getting to know the winemakers, I get to learn from them, buy exclusive wines not available anywhere else and I have been given wines they have been experimenting with.
I prefer to buy my wine directly from the winery because of quality control.
I don't believe most of the wine sold at retail in Las Vegas was transported across the desert in temperature controlled vehicles. I have no idea how long the wine has been sitting under the warm bright lights of the store. That being said, I do have a neighborhood wine shop, whose owner I know and trust and I buy wine from.
.
Those are all really good points. We also only buy retail from merchants we know well. When we were wino babies, we bought at Costco and Cost Plus and BevMo and places like that, but now it's rare if we buy from those stores. | | | |
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whiner
Second star to the right, and straight on till morning
Wine Thief
Posts:2875
| | 03/16/2005 8:41 PM |
| CWG,
I tend to agree with you, but, I think there are grey-area exceptions. eg. Even though I can find KL for $45 retail if I look hard, if I'm going to be paying the same money, I would prefer to give it directly to the winery -- if for no other reason than I really like the guys. I can find some Martinellis at retail, but I buy direct on those, too, so that I can sooner get onto their "A" mailer.
a | |
I can't listen to that much Wagner. I start getting the urge to conquer Poland.
-- Woody Allen | |
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Edward Bowers
Palm Beach Gardens
Barrel Sampler
Posts:2072
| | 03/16/2005 9:13 PM |
| In addition to the mailer cost, add freight. That number is already in the retail cost.  | | | |
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ChangeMe
Master of Wine
Posts:12891
| | 03/17/2005 1:47 AM |
| | another problem i have with buying direct is i have to double ship everything. this can add substantial per bottle cost. like someone said above, i have no problem supporting the wineries but i think they should in return support their good customers. when their wine starts showing up at retail substantially less, something is wrong. i would would safely assume if a retail estabishment can sell it to me for 20% less than i think the winery could kick at least a 10% discount to good customers. or at least offer some kind of shipping incentives. | | | |
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Chicago Wine Geek
Chicago Western Suburbs
Wine Labeler
Posts:3672
| | 03/17/2005 1:55 AM |
| Whiner -
If the price is the same, I would always buy from the mailer... | | | |
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Drew
Sammamish, WA
Wine Bottler
Posts:3193
| | 03/17/2005 3:09 PM |
| I primarily buy from mailers, but they're all allocated wines that I either could not buy retail or am unwilling to pay ridiculous mark-ups on. I learned my lesson the hard way - as a noob, I started off with Jordan one year and bought a case at one of their release parties, only to find it on sale for $12 a bottle cheaper at five or six different lcoations, including a Safeway. Lesson #1 Don't buy Jordan at the winery. Lesson #2 Don't buy Jordan at all.
At present, shipping and tax are not issues for me (OR), but that is changing. | | | |
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Tom
Barrel Sampler
Posts:2384
| | 03/17/2005 10:22 PM |
| Quote:
Good points! Plus, you still have to pay shipping costs on top of the "retail" price that the winery charges you. I only buy from the mailing list if I can't get a wine at a retail outlet.
So, we support the shippers too!
Free extra money for everyone!
Yippie!
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ChangeMe
Master of Wine
Posts:12891
| | 03/17/2005 11:55 PM |
| Quote:
Quote:
Good points! Plus, you still have to pay shipping costs on top of the "retail" price that the winery charges you. I only buy from the mailing list if I can't get a wine at a retail outlet.
So, we support the shippers too!
Free extra money for everyone!
Yippie!
especially NVL
i guess everyone wins except us  | | | |
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