Marco  
Barrel Sampler
Posts: 2070
 | | 10-28-2004 04:18 PM |
| There was an interesting article in yesterday's L.A. Times. Check it out at www.latimes.com and go to the food section. Registration is free, quick and easy. It describes the apparently common practice of adding up to 15 % of water to must to reduce high alcohol levels. SeaSmoke and Sanford were mentionned by name, but many more wineries seem to be doing this. The practice is illegal in France and in Australia there is a max of 3 % water that can be added. I am not sure what to think of this. Winemakers are not adding chemicals or unnatural substances, but it is still a bit disturbing. I tasted a SeaSmoke Botella this week and commented that it tasted a bit sweet at first and hot on the finish and I can only imagine what it would taste like without the addition of water. Is adding water ok as long as the finished product turns out great or should one insist on the purest possible product with minimal intervention? What do the experts think? | | |
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MTPockets
Barrel Racker
Posts: 1834
| | 10-28-2004 06:26 PM |
| There are other ways to reduce alcohol levels, too. Centrifugation and filtration are 2 that I am aware of but I'm sure there are others that the VC vintners can speak to.
It's interesting that so many of the old world wine laws demanded minimum natural alcohol levels as a sign of quality while the new world wines often struggle with too much alcohol. | | | |
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JonesWineNo1
Sommelier
Posts: 8568
| | 10-28-2004 06:55 PM |
| | Hoses are used more often then people think. Far far less than an ideal solution imo. | | | |
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DJ Hombre
Napa Valley, California
Barrel Filler
Posts: 1367
| | 10-28-2004 07:27 PM |
| I find it funny that all of a sudden people are freaking out that wineries add water. It's perfectly fine. I dunno about using water from the well... not exactly the purest water. I'd imagine guys like Seasmoke use clean spring water they have shipped in.
I think there was a thread about this on ebob a month ago or so.
I think if the juice needs it, then by all means, add water. You're just adding back what nature took away. | | | |
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JonesWineNo1
Sommelier
Posts: 8568
| | 10-28-2004 07:38 PM |
| | That is way too simplistic of an analysis. | | | |
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winebrat
Sacramento, Ca.
Barrel Sampler
Posts: 2326
| | 10-28-2004 08:37 PM |
| | I believe it is called 'Jesus Teers' when winemakers do this. | | | "Everyday is worthy of a glass of sparkling wine" - Andrea Immer MS | |
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DJ Hombre
Napa Valley, California
Barrel Filler
Posts: 1367
| | 10-28-2004 10:52 PM |
| Quote:
That is way too simplistic of an analysis.
Why bother with a 3 page essay when it can be summed up in a few sentences.
Grapes dehydrate on the vine. Add water to the must to make up for the water lost to dehydration. | | | |
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Bob Bressler 
Napa Valley
Wine Lover
Posts: 4894
| | 10-28-2004 11:03 PM |
| It is generally better to irrigate at the right times. This will replace the water content, lower the brix all in time to achieve a balance inside the grape.
This year was particularly difficult as the big heat wave came in September at the very end of the plants growing cycle (remember we started 3 to 4 weeks early). That made it difficult to get the plants to draw enough water up to the grapes.
If you got caught short and didn't start watering early enough, you still had to wait for the flavor development and wound up with dehydrated grapes. Adding water during crush might then be necessary just to get things back in balance.
But, it is still better the irrigate properly. | | | |
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DJ Hombre
Napa Valley, California
Barrel Filler
Posts: 1367
| | 10-28-2004 11:18 PM |
| Quote:
But, it is still better the irrigate properly.
and a hellofa lot easier on the winemakers. | | | |
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ChangeMe
Grape Sorter
Posts: 307
| | 10-29-2004 01:29 AM |
| | i say whatever it takes to make the wine better, go for it. | | | |
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Randy Wigginton
Master of Wine
Posts: 10813
| | 10-29-2004 02:17 PM |
| | In a UC Davis course, they claimed the practice of directly adding water to must in California is illegal. However, they noted that many wineries have to "wash the presses" (wink wink nudge nudge). The technical term they use is "Jesus Units" (water into wine). | | | |
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ChangeMe
Barrel Filler
Posts: 1475
| | 10-29-2004 05:26 PM |
| | I have no knowledge of this, but it seems that adding water would not be a good solution because it is going to dilute all the other flavor components along with the alcohol. Even though the alcohol is high, the extraction, acidity, etc. might not be, and those ratios will also all be affected by dilution. | | | |
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Randy Sloan
St. Helena
Wine Labeler
Posts: 3998
| | 10-29-2004 05:52 PM |
| Like RandyW, I heard in my UC Davis course that adding water was illegal in CA, but have since been told by many winemakers that it is not now. Someday I'll dig around the web to find out the official answer, but...
Adding water is sometimes done, but I don't know any winemaker who wants to do it. Winemakers generally don't want to mess with the wine in any way with the belief that any dillution, any filtering, any "anything" could remove something you want to keep as well as the unwanted sugar. But alas, with the current trend of extending hangtimes to get as much flavor as possible, we can run in to really high brix and unless everyone wants 18% alcohol (that is, if you can even get it to ferment dry) sometimes a little water finds it way back in the wine. One technique is after one grape lot is crushed, a bolus of SO2 and water is sent down the hose to clean it out before the next wine. The amount of water in that bolus can lower the potential alcohol a bit. | | Randy Sloan
Match Vineyards | |
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Randy Wigginton
Master of Wine
Posts: 10813
| | 10-30-2004 02:45 PM |
| | Hey Randy, the answer is buried in the above article. In 2002 a new interpretation of rules was requested, and since that time water addition is legal. But like you say, no one really wants to do it because it dilutes the flavors, etc. But when a wine is over 18% alcohol... what are you going to do? | | | |
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skwid
Wine Connoisseur
Posts: 5452
| | 10-30-2004 04:23 PM |
| Quote:
But when a wine is over 18% alcohol... what are you going to do?
Reverse Osmosis | | | |
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JonesWineNo1
Sommelier
Posts: 8568
| | 11-01-2004 05:41 PM |
| | Taste it and see if it has the stuffing to balance the alcohol. | | | |
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Pool Boy
Laurl, MD (DC suburb)
Master of Wine
Posts: 13767
| | 11-01-2004 08:35 PM |
| | I'm no expert, but I'd like my wine as unadulterated as possible. But I am not sure I am a sensitive enough taster to notice differences of this nature (water being added, etc). | | | www.roguefood.com -- www.cellartracker.com | |
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Bob Bressler
Napa Valley
Wine Lover
Posts: 4894
| | 11-01-2004 08:56 PM |
| Quote:
I'd like my wine as unadulterated as possible.
Is that what you really mean? Or, might you mean that you would like your wines to be a good expression of the vineyard and varietal and not engineered to have a particular style? I suspect that you really trust the winemaker to do what is required to make the best wine possible. Right? | | | |
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JonesWineNo1
Sommelier
Posts: 8568
| | 11-01-2004 08:59 PM |
| | Within certain parameters - yes. | | | |
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Pool Boy
Laurl, MD (DC suburb)
Master of Wine
Posts: 13767
| | 11-01-2004 09:24 PM |
| Quote:
Quote:
I'd like my wine as unadulterated as possible.
Is that what you really mean? Or, might you mean that you would like your wines to be a good expression of the vineyard and varietal and not engineered to have a particular style? I suspect that you really trust the winemaker to do what is required to make the best wine possible. Right?
That's what I basically meant. I'd like to keep out any mumbo jumbo from my wine. Let the winemaker make the best possible wine of his/her expressive style as it matches to that varietal's and vineyard's best characteristics. | | | www.roguefood.com -- www.cellartracker.com | |
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