JonesWineNo1 
Sommelier
Posts: 8568
 | | 04-30-2004 06:05 PM |
| I said reserve level i.e. for Beaucastel, the Hommage de J. Perrin. Many vintages of Hommage are seriously tannic. | | | |
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ChangeMe
Master of Wine
Posts: 11169
| | 04-30-2004 06:11 PM |
| Unfortunately, I have never had the Hommages a Jacquer Perrin.  I did buy a magnum of it that Enoselsa won at a raffle. I have had other reserves and Vieilles Vignes. Someday, when I win the lottery, I'm getting the Hommages. | | | |
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rmkam
Grape Fermenter
Posts: 524
| | 04-30-2004 06:21 PM |
| Quote:
There are no CdPs with "huge tannins."
Depends how you define "huge". Certainly a young CdP has LESS gripping tannin than a young Cote Rotie or Bordeaux. | | | |
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scottj
Houston, TX
Barrel Filler
Posts: 1116
| | 04-30-2004 06:46 PM |
| tj, I don't know if this qualifies as "readily", but this is still on the shelves at Specs in Houston, for around $33 (cash price). Check out Specs. wine-searcher also shows some sources. | | | |
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Pool Boy
Laurl, MD (DC suburb)
Master of Wine
Posts: 13786
| | 04-30-2004 07:30 PM |
| Vielen dank, scottj. I'll check it out. | | | www.roguefood.com -- www.cellartracker.com | |
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Winetex
Austin, Texas (pretty fall colors here)
Master of Wine
Posts: 11302
| | 04-30-2004 07:53 PM |
| Scott - you're messing with my supply!  | | | |
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Eric LeVine
Grape Sorter
Posts: 384
| | 04-30-2004 08:29 PM |
| I always tend to bristle at the "it's way too early you idiot" advice. Usually the poster is correct of course. I have had 1990 Pegau, and it is otherworldy. Then again I have had 1999, 2000 and 2001, and those are remarkably enjoyable as well, just different. For me, the beauty of the Southern Rhone wines is that they have such an approachable drinking curve. They are juicy, delicious and approachable early and yet age beautifully. Clearly the answer for me is to drink some young and some old. If the advice given about this wine is "please make sure to save some for at LEAST 10 years from now", ok, that I totally get. If the advice is a statement that I am an idiot and am missing out and committing a crime, well, ok, keep your advice to yourself...  Certainly, if you compare Chateaneuf du Pape to Bordeaux, what I state is obvious. It is fun to pop a few young Bordeaux with a steak just to revel in the fruit and tannin, but anyone who has had well aged (20+ years), well stored wines from a great vintage like 1982 understands the crime of drinking too many too early. That's why my better 2000 Bordeaux is stored offsite in a storage location with simply terrible hours.  | | | |
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ChangeMe
Grape Sorter
Posts: 307
| | 05-01-2004 01:15 AM |
| ...and that is why my 00 bordeaux is all nailed away and buried  | | | |
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Seek
Upstate NY
Wine Thief
Posts: 2772
| | 05-01-2004 02:43 AM |
| Quote:
I always tend to bristle at the "it's way too early you idiot" advice. Usually the poster is correct of course. I have had 1990 Pegau, and it is otherworldy. Then again I have had 1999, 2000 and 2001, and those are remarkably enjoyable as well, just different.
For me, the beauty of the Southern Rhone wines is that they have such an approachable drinking curve. They are juicy, delicious and approachable early and yet age beautifully. Clearly the answer for me is to drink some young and some old.
If the advice given about this wine is "please make sure to save some for at LEAST 10 years from now", ok, that I totally get. If the advice is a statement that I am an idiot and am missing out and committing a crime, well, ok, keep your advice to yourself...
Certainly, if you compare Chateaneuf du Pape to Bordeaux, what I state is obvious. It is fun to pop a few young Bordeaux with a steak just to revel in the fruit and tannin, but anyone who has had well aged (20+ years), well stored wines from a great vintage like 1982 understands the crime of drinking too many too early. That's why my better 2000 Bordeaux is stored offsite in a storage location with simply terrible hours.
Eric, well said.
I Love young wines, I Love properly aged wines, it is part of the enjoyment of watching wines progress. Nothing wrong with either. I have tried plenty of young wines that I have significant supply of to go the distance. | | | |
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ChangeMe
Grape Puncher
Posts: 986
| | 05-02-2004 12:52 PM |
| You've got to taste them young to really understand if they will age well. If you don't taste them young then you're just relying on advice about ageworthiness. I want to know!
The most fun experiment in wine: buy 24 bottles of the same ageworthy wine. Drink one every six months for 12 years. You really see the changed that way. This works with Southern Rhones and lesser Bordeaux (e.g. Potensac). It's really cool. | | | |
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ChangeMe
Grape Puncher
Posts: 886
| | 05-03-2004 07:10 PM |
| I'm grateful for a wine like the `99 that has so much to offer now as well as mid-term aging potential. Showing a near perfect balance of leather, roses, layered fruit, and Provence herbs, I've been through over a case so far. I've got plenty left for the future.
On the other hand, I've only tried one bottle out of two cases of `98 Pegau as a data point and won't open another for three years. While I haven't touched any `98 Vieux Telegraphe, I've enjoyed several bottles of `98 Dom. Monpertuis Tradition and `98 Dom. Charbonnieres Les Hautes Brusquieres while reserving a supply for the future. A third of my cellar is Chateauneuf, young and old. While I wouldn't touch any `01 VT or `01 Vieux Donjon, I wouldn't hesitate to open the `01 Clos Des Papes; it's so tasty now.
Sure, drinking a good mature CdP is one of my greatest pleasures and if that is the only goal for someone, that's fine, but I've been doing this long enough that I'm sorry, I don't need to be told that I'm doing something wrong when I enjoy certain ones in their youth. | | | |
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ChangeMe
Master of Wine
Posts: 11169
| | 05-03-2004 10:08 PM |
| Rieslingfan, I did something similar to your little experiment with the 1978 Vieux Telegraphe. I did learn a lot. I learned to let them reach maturity. | | | |
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ChangeMe
Grape Sorter
Posts: 307
| | 05-03-2004 11:36 PM |
| i for one am going to take the advice and try not to drink most of my better bordeaux and cdps until they come of age. someday i hope to have a cellar like board-o's where i can consistently drink high quality perfectly aged wine. in fact i hope that by keeping my cellar @52 degrees that my wine will age even longer. | | | |
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Budman
Philly Suburbs
VinoCellar.com Extraordinaire
Posts: 23705
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Pool Boy
Laurl, MD (DC suburb)
Master of Wine
Posts: 13786
| | 05-04-2004 01:09 PM |
| Quote:
i for one am going to take the advice and try not to drink most of my better bordeaux and cdps until they come of age. someday i hope to have a cellar like board-o's where i can consistently drink high quality perfectly aged wine. in fact i hope that by keeping my cellar @52 degrees that my wine will age even longer.
I'm too bloody impatient. Besides, I need to keep making room for more stuff. Man I need to get more storage space. Someday. | | | www.roguefood.com -- www.cellartracker.com | |
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rmkam
Grape Fermenter
Posts: 524
| | 05-04-2004 11:23 PM |
| Quote:
i for one am going to take the advice and try not to drink most of my better bordeaux and cdps until they come of age. someday i hope to have a cellar like board-o's where i can consistently drink high quality perfectly aged wine. in fact i hope that by keeping my cellar @52 degrees that my wine will age even longer.
Hey what are you 18 years old  Turn that temperature up or you are never going to live long enough to drink those wines at peak  | | | |
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ChangeMe
Grape Sorter
Posts: 307
| | 05-04-2004 11:34 PM |
| 29 and i plan on living a long long time another reason i keep it cold is that i don't drink that much anymore. maybe 1-2 bottles a week. i am trying slow down the maturation rate of my earlier drinkers. i have some 99 l'ecole's that still taste like babies even though according to ws, they should be on the downslope. | | | |
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ChangeMe
Grape Puncher
Posts: 986
| | 05-12-2004 04:45 PM |
| With a cellar full of '98, '99, '00 and '01 CNdP I can afford to drink the '99s. There will be plenty to let age to maturity.  | | | |
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Eric White
San Ramon, CA
Advanced Sommelier
Posts: 9563
| | 07-31-2006 09:41 PM |
| A classic example of CdP, I loved this wine. Offering up wonderful aromas of dark fruits, meat, earth, and dry herbs, fine ripe tannins on the palate, complex and complete, with a fine lingering finish. | | | 2008: the end of an error | |
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ChangeMe
Barrel Filler
Posts: 1371
| | 07-31-2006 10:00 PM |
| Eric - When we had this in May, its barnyard characteristic was really prominent, did not blow off and overpowered the wine to my taste. This is not normally a flavor profile I have a problem with. Did you notice any of this, or do you think my bottle was just particularly barnyardy? | | | |
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