ChangeMe
Grape Sorter
Posts:210
 | | 04/21/2003 9:58 PM |
| I know there are quite a few Riesling afficinados here so hopefully, this is a simple question. Although the price difference is considerable, I cannot find a rating distinction between certain Gold Cap productions and the standard white caps (i.e. '01 J J Prum Auslese). Both are obviously delicious but I was just curious. Perhaps I have researched incorrectly.
TIA,
pe | | | |
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stemor
Collierville, TN
Wine Thief
Posts:2813
| | 04/21/2003 10:15 PM |
| PE,
The '01 JJ Prum GKA (Goldkap Auslese) didn't even get rated, but you're right. The standard Auslese was rated a 96, so the Goldkap can't POSSIBLY be much better. Can it?!?
It comes down to supply/demand, the demand created by prestige: There were 70 cases of Wehlener Sonnenuhr GKA produced vs. 1,500 cases of the "regular" Auslese.
The GKA is SUPPOSED to be better, though I haven't yet cracked one of my 12 bottles open. It should be a bit tastier and age a bit better, but is it worth the 2x the price? Probably not. And certainly not at this young age ... perhaps the difference will start to exhibit itself twenty years from now.
Having said that, I have some that I'll share with you if you'd like some ...
Steve
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Cheers, y'all | |
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ChangeMe
Grape Sorter
Posts:210
| | 04/21/2003 10:49 PM |
| Wow-not one comment about my recent rebirth in Riesling!
You're showing such restraint!!
It took me awhile to realize that not all Riesling tastes like Eroica!
I don't even want to tell you how far I've gone with this--OY VAY! | | | |
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stemor
Collierville, TN
Wine Thief
Posts:2813
| | 04/22/2003 3:43 AM |
| It's OK, PE, you're among friends. 
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Cheers, y'all | |
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ChangeMe
Master of Wine
Posts:12891
| | 04/22/2003 3:26 PM |
| Stemor,
i need you to take me to school on reisling. how does it age? does it get sweeter or more dry? i have been buying mostly 01 german kabinett and spatlese. i was wondering on drinking windows. nothing specific just some kind of general terms. | | | |
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TCK
Barrel Filler
Posts:1279
| | 04/22/2003 8:13 PM |
| Ant,
Riesling is able to age due to the high acidity content. For a good Spatlese you can go 10 years to the prime drinking window. When they age they I find that they take on a certain honey profile. However, not everyone enjoys aged riesling. Some people pick up a distinct petrol aroma from older bottles that they do not enjoy. | | | |
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GATC
Barrel Sampler
Posts:2420
| | 04/22/2003 8:36 PM |
| Stemor, nice explanation. I couldn't pull the trigger to guy a gold capsule, but traded for one with Sun Hee. Whether it is worth the price or not is certainly up to the individual.
The talk of petrol from aging is starting to concern me. I've never liked this attribute. I only thought it occurs in inferior wine, but when Rhonefan, Stealthman_1 and I tried the older Egon Muller Schartzhofberger and noticed it, I was beginning to wonder. This is one about the most expensive German riesling that you can buy. Just as well, I don't think my 2001's are going to last 10-20 years anyway. At this rate I'm drinking it, it will only last about 5. | | | |
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ChangeMe
Master of Wine
Posts:12891
| | 04/22/2003 9:42 PM |
| GATC,
with all the 01 reislings you have bought, if they are gone in 5 years we will have to find you a liver donor  | | | |
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ChangeMe
Master of Wine
Posts:12891
| | 04/22/2003 9:43 PM |
| TCK,
thanks very much for the answer. i have about 4-5 cases and don't know how long they will last because they are so good now. | | | |
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JonesWineNo1
Sommelier
Posts:8568
| | 04/22/2003 10:06 PM |
| | I always get petrol in aged Riesling. Not a fan. | | | |
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GATC
Barrel Sampler
Posts:2420
| | 04/22/2003 10:43 PM |
| Interesting. I've never had this experience with a wine that I had bought. I've never been able to hang on to them too long before I drink them, but I'm sure some of the 1971's survived 15 years before I drank the last one.
It seemed to me that Nahe's had the petrol characteristic in young wines, but Muller is in Saar, very close to my favorite middle Mosel's.
If nothing else, I won't feel back about drinking them up early. Anthony, no problem. At 2 bottles a week, my stash will only last 5 years. That's the equivalent alcohol of 1 zin a week. Plus, my wife love rieslings and she's been drinking half of it. | | | |
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ChangeMe
Master of Wine
Posts:12891
| | 04/22/2003 10:49 PM |
| | that is actually why i got into them also. my wife loves them | | | |
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ChangeMe
Grape Sorter
Posts:210
| | 05/25/2003 1:16 AM |
| Stemor et al;
when you come to So Cal (or Vegas!) I'll share my story (adventure) of my acquired CASES!!! and of course the contents within!
I ALMOST felt guilty.......almost | | | |
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ChangeMe
Barrel Filler
Posts:1210
| | 06/21/2003 3:17 PM |
| I am still dabbling in the riesling spectrum. Just had my first spatlese the other day. (Monchhof 2001 Urziger Wurzgarten)... I have seen some of the JJ Prum around and will try that as well.
I have really liked the Kabs and Qualitatswein (estate level) stuff I have had from the 2001s. Have liked some of the trocken stuff in the past, but found some of it to have a bitter aspect that I didn't care for.
The monchhof had great flavor and solid acidity, but just seemed too sweet for a table wine. By that I mean, I felt as if I was drinking a dessert wine with dinner...
Question for the riesling enthusiasts.. Is the sweetness an aquired taste or did you just like it from the start? What are the situations when you would serve a Spat vs a Kab or other off-dry riesling? | | | |
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Jeremy Matthew
Barrel Sampler
Posts:2067
| | 06/22/2003 12:34 AM |
| For me sweetness was secondary to the actual texture of German Rieslings. The intergration of the componants blew me away. Considering that most Spatlese has less than 8 grams residual sugar the idea that these wines are sweet is sort of misleading. What it is, is that the wine has such lower levels of acids and alcohol that the sweetness comes through.
I enjoy the sweetnes of German wines now, but it really was the intergration that grabbed me. | | | |
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stemor
Collierville, TN
Wine Thief
Posts:2813
| | 06/22/2003 3:25 PM |
| Jeremy,
Are you sure you're talking about Riesling, particularly at a Spatlese level? The only thing I would agree with in this statement ...
Quote:
Considering that most Spatlese has less than 8 grams residual sugar the idea that these wines are sweet is sort of misleading. What it is, is that the wine has such lower levels of acids and alcohol that the sweetness comes through.
... is your spelling.
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Cheers, y'all | |
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GATC
Barrel Sampler
Posts:2420
| | 06/23/2003 4:19 AM |
| I was wondering the same thing. For me, anything under 20g/l is dry to me. I believe that most of the spatlesen for 2001 are in the 40-70 g/l, with the Haart Piesporter Goldtropfchen spatlese coming in at 100 g/l.
For me, the apparent sweetness doesn't bother me when I match with food. It probably does for others. In that case, I would recommend drinking it as an aperitif.
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stemor
Collierville, TN
Wine Thief
Posts:2813
| | 06/23/2003 4:28 AM |
| GATC,
Exactly -- and that sense of dryness is because of the balance between the high residual sugar and the abundance of acid. The resulting sensation is one of relatively viscous harmony & balance.
I tend to dring these white Germanic wines (usually Riesling, Rieslaner, or Scheurebe) as an appertif, but also enjoy them with mild Asian, fish, and chicken dishes. More informally, I suppose I tend to do like I did yesterday and today: pop one open and just sip it from the patio, enjoying the birds and the bees in the garden. No, really. Cardinals, sparrows, robins, and bumblebees love the landscaping in my backyard! | |
Cheers, y'all | |
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GATC
Barrel Sampler
Posts:2420
| | 06/23/2003 4:33 AM |
| Actually, Kabinett's and QBA's are probably better for food. Remember that most Kabinett's for 2001 are like spatlesen for other years. If this is still too sweet for you, then you may want to try halb trockens (half dry) or trockens (dry).
I find rieslings great with spicy Asian food and foie gras (pan fried with a sweet glaze).
I don't know if the taste for sweetness is acquired or not. My wife (girl friend then) and I had our first riesling at a Swiss restaurant (near Julius Castle in SF). I can't remember the food we had, but we loved the wine and loved it with the food.
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stemor
Collierville, TN
Wine Thief
Posts:2813
| | 06/23/2003 4:38 AM |
| GATC,
I agree, of course. Auslese and fois gras are truly a match made in heaven. I tend to go with QbA/Kabinett with up to a mildly spiced Asian dish, but for extra-spicy dishes I seem to go with Gewurztraminer or GruVe ... it's more of a personal reflex than a logical choice.
Steve
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Cheers, y'all | |
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